Save this article to read it later.
Find this story in your accountsSaved for Latersection.
(ThinkEntourage, but funny, and with women.)
She made this project personal on every front she could, hiring collaborators who were more than mere co-workers.
Then we re-met when we were 7, thats when we really met.
We were sort of like cousins, wed see each other quite a lot from 7 to about 20.
Then at about 20, it was cemented, we became inseparable.
It was mainly boys.
DW: There were two boys treating us particularly badly at this time.
Grace Van Patten:Did you both go to the same school?
Everything she was doing was slightly ahead she was acting before me, in university before me.
I ended up asking her, and she immediately said yes without needing to know anything about it.
Julia has a large presence in the film, but shes pretty seldom seen.
When writing, I did like the idea of this force thats there and not there.
Mostly creative, though she was very busy.
I remember us talking, like, Could you do two days?
I told her, I think I can do three days?
Ultimately, it adds to the whole thing that Julias elusive.
Doll assimilated the problem and made it a virtue; shes the mysterious woman in the attic.
GVP: I had no idea about any of this.
The relationship in the movie felt so purposeful to me.
Grace, you play the stock punch in of the rudderless 20-something.
I know so many people like my character Lilian, so I could think about them.
DW: She found Lilian so quickly.
I remember, at the beginning, you were saying, Oh, this is so gross.
Everything about making yourself too at-home in someone elses house.
Who doesnt have that side of themselves?
Everyone has to learn that they cant pull that off anymore.
She watched me rob her bathroom!
DW: I still sometimes do things like that, though!
There are things about Lilian that Ive taken such a long time to learn.
Timm said, Oh yeah, that happens whenever you stay here.
We do things without realizing, never give it a thought.
Is this process getting delayed?EM: Whatre you thinking of?
Until then, shes been able to cruise through life, shes had a way with boys fancying her.
Im sure hes better than his character in the movie!GVP: Nope, hes exactly like that.
Good, good, good, good, this is going good.
Funny thing, that scene was shot at my regular bar.
Youve got to attempt to find your own place and fit in somewhere that has its own history.
The other major archetype in the film is the reclusive writer, well regarded but not working much anymore.
She was sort of a mythological figure to me.
She wroteThe Pumpkin Eater, which they made into themovie with Anne Bancroft.
She was a formative influence, though I only knew her through photographs.
Towering, brilliant woman, wrote lots forThe New Yorker.
She terrified my dad, one of the only women he was ever intimidated by.
and her replying, Theyre very vulgar.
I only ever got wafts of her, but she was fascinating.
I had barely gotten halfway through by the time I realized they had a rich relationship.
But this time around, I really was taking direction, and it was just incredible.
DW: I was scared!
EM: But you were so calm in the face of it!
We had a short time to work, like all independent movies, making things potentially very chaotic.
Shes not a person on high, shes a collaborator.
Kind, generous, always made enough time to give us another take when we wanted one.
DW: I am not Zen.
EM: She was.
Id say, I dont know how to articulate this, but Im not feeling enough.
Hed frame the shot this way and that, and it wouldnt feel right until Em sat down.
I felt it instantly.
She was one part of my support system, and then there was Grace, who was a dream.
We all had each others backs in terms of these close relationships.
GVP: Id never felt so free to try things.
I felt so comfortable, and that gives you a sense of freedom thats important for an actor.
She gives everyone the opportunity to be spontaneous.
It was so fun, just a really positive experience.
DW: Its because were all women!
But maybe theres something in how women communicate, and that I personally have no pride.
I dont feel bad if Im getting something wrong, and Im ready to learn.
I wasnt afraid to admit I dont know things.
But then, having said that, the men of the film give very sensitive and perceptive performances.
you’re able to tell theyve been directed by women!DW: True!
I just want to make clear how wonderful Timm and Ebon [Moss-Bacharach] were.
DW: It doesnt work when everyones coming in for the day and thinking about it like a job.
Zadie Smith, Martin Amis, and Jonathan Ames all appear in the movie.
Em actually knew Martin separately, and had been friends with Zadie.
EM: My dad knew him.
They were both writers.
My dad was old enough to know Kingsley Amis, actually.
Zadie Smith, Im not sure how we know each other.
Id met her around, I suppose?
All English people know one another.
DW: We almost lost Zadie.
Like, of course we shouldve just done that from the start.
Their speaking was almost all improvised.
For Americans,Doll & Emis very difficult to find.
Its not on HBO Go, none of the streaming services, no DVDs.
DW: Were constantly being asked about this, still.
Mention this, hey, maybe itll do something.
